Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hello and thank you for joining us. Welcome to what Counts, the podcast where we explore real world challenges and opportunities shaping information governance today.
Each episode draws on our experience working across industries, turning proven strategies into practical insights you can apply inside your own organization.
Whether you're navigating information governance, facing a specific need, or simply curious about issues like email management, retention, contract data, or asset data management, this podcast gives you a clear, actionable perspective on what truly counts in a in building a strong sustainable governance practice.
This is Lee and in this episode, Moore and I will talk about possible solutions to the tension between growth and governance.
[00:00:52] Speaker B: I love the listeners who are just curious about email management.
[00:00:58] Speaker A: You know, there's got to be some out there.
[00:01:00] Speaker B: There absolutely are.
I'm curious about all kinds of crazy things, so why not?
Email management isn't one of them anymore because I've studied it a lot, but there are other things. Anyway, let's get into this. Last time we talked about governance versus growth, and growth at all costs, I think is one of the themes that came out.
And while growth certainly sounds like a good idea in all cases, if you're a small business, you want to grow to be a bigger business. If you're a bigger business, you want to grow even bigger. If you are a community or a society, you want to grow in better directions, in good directions, provide more safety, more food, more education, more opportunities for curiosity.
I like growth.
I'm not anti growth. I'm taking it personally. Because the information governance world, we're often called the records police.
We end up being in a position where it feels like we're saying no to things.
I think that's the personalization of that tension between governance and growth.
Let's take a metaphor out of the engineering world. An ungoverned engine will run out of control.
I had this past week my generator, because it's been extremely cold here, There was such cold that the battery stopped charging, the voltage regulator broke, and then the controller broke.
And so the repairman who came to check this out, I didn't know all those things had happened. I just know there was a warning light on the battery.
He came out and he said, yeah, it's off right now. If I could get it to turn on, that would not end pretty.
And at the same time he said that I said it would blow up, right? And he said yes, because the voltage regulator isn't working, the controller isn't working.
So the propane that charges the generator that feeds the generator would have nothing to govern it. Govern would be an unrestricted flow into the engine of the generator, which could result in an explosion.
That's true for all types of engines. And that's what we're talking about here too when we're talking about governing the growth engine because there's risk.
Do you like that?
[00:03:28] Speaker A: I buy it. Yeah, totally buy it.
[00:03:30] Speaker B: Okay, but, but, so let's try in that vein though.
Nobody wants to be the records police.
Nobody wants to just say no. And it doesn't even have to be the information governance team on their own because security also has the same tension that's part of the same puzzle.
Because the most secure computer system is one that is not connected to anything.
[00:03:55] Speaker A: That's true.
[00:03:56] Speaker B: It's completely cut off from the outside world and it's hyper secure. It also doesn't really support your business if your business involves interacting with anybody else. Right, so, so then if we don't want to be the, the records police and we don't want to be the hardcore shut everything down security people, how do we approach this problem, this governance and growth problem?
What do you think?
[00:04:22] Speaker A: We become a governance accelerator?
[00:04:27] Speaker B: We could become a governance accelerator and we're trying to get there and provide that to other people at our Trailblazer Learning Academy.
But one of the ways that we've learned to do that is by partnering with other people.
So when we're working in an organization, we might be working for the legal department, we often are, but we always immediately ask to work with the IT department.
We depending on the organization also want to talk to compliance or audit.
And finally, not, not least and in any way the business, the forward facing group from the organization where legal and IT and compliance might be kind of back office functions.
So were pulling people together and saying to them, you all have this problem where you are trying to grow as fast as you can, but there's risk and you need governance.
And it's not enough for each of you to come up with your own governance because that's just going to introduce conflicts, not through lack of effort. Just because two or three or ten people trying to solve the same problem without talking to each other are going to run into problems.
You and I, even in the last couple of weeks keep trying to solve problems on our own because there just hasn't been time to talk and it's not going great, I would say.
[00:06:05] Speaker A: And it's not hard to find these people. Right? You just have to phrase it correctly.
People want consistency in their life and that's part of what we're talking about here. People want less risk when they Go to work and not have to worry about, oh, I signed that check, should I have done that? Right? So there's got to be some governance around it so they want less risk.
They want to be able to have a path forward or documentation that shows where the accountability is.
So I think there's. You gotta be able to talk about it the right way, not just say, hey, we're going to be the records police.
[00:06:43] Speaker B: No, we never say that. It's very people that accuse us of that. But we talk a lot about compliance because one reason for keeping documentation is to demonstrate compliance with policies, with regulations, with laws.
But another important reason to keep documentation is to ensure consistency or support and promote consistency. So you might. You have policies and you have process so that the same activity happens the same way every time and you have more certain results.
Another reason for documentation is when you're interacting with someone outside of your company, you want to ensure that there's a shared understanding of what's going to happen here.
We're going to have a purchase and sale transaction where I want to purchase from you 2000 pencils. As one of our recent collaborators talks about pencils all the time, I want 2,000 pencils. I'm going to buy them from you, Lee. And my picture in my head is I'm going to get 2000 yellow number two pencils with a point.
I want them to already be sharpened, but also I'd like you to give me a sharpener that's in my head. I didn't write it down. All I said to you is 2000 pencils. What are you going to bring me?
[00:08:07] Speaker A: Unsharpened pencil, maybe. Maybe unused erasers, but they'll be unsharpened pencils.
[00:08:14] Speaker B: I think there's a chance you would bring me mechanical pencils because you have an obsession with them.
[00:08:19] Speaker A: That's true.
[00:08:22] Speaker B: So we didn't write it down. We didn't. We agreed that you'd bring me 2,000 pencils. Maybe we agreed on a price.
I don't know. $150 for 2000 pencils doesn't seem like enough. But that's in this world. That's what's going to be worse would be we agreed on 150pencils. And I had in mind the mechanical pencils, but you had in mind the yellow pencils. And in fact, they don't even have erasers. They're not pointy and they don't have erasers because what do you expect for one.
[00:08:56] Speaker A: There you go.
[00:08:58] Speaker B: So the documentation of that transaction, the expectations on Both sides, that we put that into contracts, typically.
And the better the contract, the more distinct it is, the more descriptive it is, the likelier that the transaction will be completed to everyone's satisfaction. Obviously buying pencils is pretty low stakes, but there are transactions and there are contracts and legal agreements around much larger activities where the stakes are much higher.
[00:09:33] Speaker A: So people in your coalition have to have expertise in certain areas. So they come back with the sharpened piece or the yellow pencil or the fact that you might get mechanical. They each need to know something to be able to contribute.
[00:09:47] Speaker B: Here everybody knows something because in fact the number two pencil doesn't work on the, the highly specialized form we bought from Bob because Bob has a form and it reads because you know, this is an old fashioned kind of thing where he's got a, an experimental or not experimental. It's like an 80 year old system that he wants to test with some Scantron activity.
[00:10:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:15] Speaker B: And you have to have the number one pencil for this particular thing or the number one lead or whatever.
So all those pieces come together and your coalition across your company, each group represents their own interest, but together you get a better deal for the company.
And I think that that is a good metaphor for how you can apply governance to growth.
Because sell at all cost.
You could have a rogue sales guy, salesperson out there promising everything to your customers. Of course I can do a, a rush order of 10,000 pencils by tomorrow and we'll get them to Alaska.
But your delivery guy says, well, there's this avalanche in Alaska, so I cannot deliver. And your factory says I can't do a 10,000, 10,000 pencil rush order that have, you know, custom names on the side. It takes us, you know, three days to set up the print job and we have to get the right wood or the right paint or whatever the pieces are to do that can't be done.
And so your sales guy is like, but I sold 10,000 pencils and I made us a bunch of money.
Only you didn't because you failed to deliver. The company couldn't deliver on that.
So from a growth perspective, that was a negative because you didn't deliver that you had to pay the money back. Maybe there was a penalty for failing to deliver on time. Maybe. And that dissatisfied customer is going to tell other people.
So governance, not just information governance, but governance across the company is really supportive of growth. At least good governances.
We've got a lot more to say about governance. Should we keep going for a minute or should we save it for next time?
[00:12:29] Speaker A: We're at a pretty good stopping point.
[00:12:31] Speaker B: All right then let's stop there and we will see you soon. Thanks everyone.
[00:12:36] Speaker A: If you have any questions, please send us an email at inforailblazer.us.com or look us up on the web at www.trailblazer.us.com or the Learning Academy at www.trailblazerlearningacademy.com. thank you for listening and please tune in to our next episode. Also, if you like this episode, please be a champion, share it with people in your social media network or like, and subscribe to our podcast. As always, we appreciate you, the listeners. Special thanks goes to Jason Blake, who created our music.
[00:13:08] Speaker B: Thanks everyone.
